The interview of ROGER SCOTT by BOB MILLS is an important document in the Debra Jean Milke Case. As SALDATE'S report of his interview with SCOTT shows, ROGER SCOTT confessed to participating in the murder of CHRISTOPHER MILKE. It should be noted that DETECTIVE SALDATE wrote that report three days after his interrogation of SCOTT, on December 6, 1989, but after he had already written the report about his interrogation of Debra. Does it make sense to write a report chronologically twisted?
For at least half an hour, the story SCOTT told was of how JIM STYERS couldn't stand CHRIS, wanted him killed, and finally worked up the nerve to commit the murder. But we can't know the details stated in that report with certainty, as it's nothing more but SALDATE's narration of what allegedly transpired. Then, as they rode out to find CHRIS' body, SCOTT purportedly said that Debra Milke was involved in the murder of CHRIS, her son. Incredibly, as the report of SALDATE'S fellow detective BOB MILLS reveals, MILLS doesn't even mention this alleged incrimination of SCOTT in his account!
This interrogation was
tape-recorded, so we can see precisely what was said. SCOTT has a reasonable memory of his actions on December 3rd, the day of the murder. But, as MILLS tried to get details about the planning of the
killing - and especially of the involvement of Debra Milke which he had
claimed - SCOTT became completely confused. In fact, taking SCOTT'S testimony at his own trial into account - especially his statements to prosecutor NOEL LEVY upon cross-examination - we simply have to suspect that large parts of what SCOTT said here on this taped are what somebody else told him to say! This is what was said between ROGER SCOTT and County prosecutor NOEL LEVY at SCOTT'S own trial in January 1991:
Excerpts of ROGER SCOTT'S testimony at his own trial [01/31/1991]:
(...)
Noel Levy: Now, Styers approached you and made it known to you that he wanted to get rid of Christopher; is that so?
Roger Scott: If you can explain that?
Noel Levy: Did Styers approach you and basically make it known to you that he wanted to get rid of Christopher?
Roger Scott: No.
(...)
Noel Levy: And you talked face to face about doing away with Christopher within the last week at least twice with her; is that correct?
Roger Scott: She ---
Noel Levy: Yes or no, Mr. Scott?
Roger Scott: I believe it does say that on the tape.
(...)
Noel Levy: And they offered you money, too; is that correct?
Roger Scott: They had.
Noel Levy: Yes or no?
Roger Scott: Well, I'll have to say no.
(...)
Noel Levy: Yes, they had offered you money, Mr. Scott; is that a yes, sir?
Roger Scott: I'll have to say no, unless I'm able to explain it.
Noel Levy: Do you remember saying this in the taped statement to Detective Mills on December 3rd, 1989?
Roger Scott: I remember it being on -- hearing it on the tape.
(...)
Noel Levy: And you talked about taking care of Christopher, didn't you?
Roger Scott: No, it was just -- I know it says that on the tape.
(...)
Roger Scott: We went into the east side, too shallow. We crossed to the West side. And then ----
Noel Levy: About fifty feet, yourself?
Roger Scott: No, I wouldn't say that.
Noel Levy: You wouldn't?
Roger Scott: No.
Noel Levy: And then Jim Styers says "I'm going to do it up there, on up, close enough to where they can find the body in a couple of days, maybe three."
He said that, didn't he?
Roger Scott: That's what it says on the tape.
(...)
Noel Levy: So, Mr. Scott, you knew in fact while in the wash and before the wash that Styers was going to execute Christopher Milke, did you not?
Roger Scott: No, I didn't.
(...)
Noel Levy: Well, you just testified on direct that he came to you and asked you to help him kill the child; didn't you testify to that on direct, Mr. Scott; yes or no?
Roger Scott: I would have to say no.
Noel Levy: You didn't testify?
Roger Scott: If I cannot explain it, no.
(...)
We will find a string of convincing indications in the transcript of this tape-recorded interrogation that SCOTT was eager to tell a scenario which he was apparently supposed to state, like futile endeavors to reproduce the fragments an external source suggested him to say. Taking SCOTT'S confused mind and his inability to remember things into account, it becomes clear why he simply could not put two consistent sentences together. MILLS tried several times to get a story form SCOTT about the planning of the murder and Debra's alleged involvement, helpfully leading SCOTT and feeding him details. But his efforts were futile and MILLS eventually gave up.
So, within a few hours after ROGER SCOTT allegedly implicated Debra Milke - the only "evidence" linking her to the crime - he was completely unable to give any sort of logical, understandable, or believable story about her alleged involvement, even with the leading questioning of a detective anxious for SCOTT to tell the story of how the crime purportedly took place.
TAPED INTERVIEW OF ROGER SCOTT
Conducted by: DET. R. MILLS 2781
Date: 12/3/89
Time: 8:12PM
Location: 620 W. Washington, in a holding room.
DETECTIVE MILLS
ROGER SCOTT
Det. Mills: ROGER, you've talked with me, you've talked with other detectives, and you've talked with Armando Saldate about the investigation concerning Christopher Milke, right?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Okay, you're going to need to speak up just a little bit.
Roger Scott: Yes sir.
Det. Mills: Maybe even move into the tape a little closer. You remember sometime around noon or so when DET. SALDATE read you your Miranda warnings, right?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Okay, and those rights were you have the right to remain silent, anything you say can be used against you in a court of law, you have the right to the presence of an attorney to assist you prior to questioning and to be with you during questioning if you so desire, if you can't afford an attorney you have the right to have an attorney appointed for you prior to questioning, and do you understand these rights?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Were those the same rights that Armando read to you earlier today?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Okay. Basically what I want to go over with you is the fact that you were at the Metro Center shopping mall yesterday afternoon and spoke with officers then, correct?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Okay, then last night or on the night of the 2nd officers contacted you at your home?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Comment: We need to insert a first clarification at this point: A TV documentary about Debra Milke's case falsely describes the fact of mentioning SCOTT to police as a result of 'pressing on JIM STYERS'. This is untrue. The truth is that JIM STYERS all of a sudden and completely voluntarily mentioned the name of his old buddy ROGER and claimed that he had met him at the Metro Center mall. Police never pressed on JIM in order to get this information. Therefore we need to ask ourselves: Why would JIM SYTERS mention ROGER SOCTT at all? The reason is plain to see. After ROGER had shot CHRISTOPHER MILKE, both men must have driven back to Phoenix, where they sat down in a Pizza parlor, concocted and agreed on a story to tell police. Thereafter JIM dropped ROGER off and drove to the Metro Center himself. He had to give police and Debra a reason why CHRISTOPHER was not with him anymore. ROGER SCOTT was apparently JIM STYERS' alibi and witness that CHRISTOPHER was at the mall, but as we know from all the details depicted on this website, this isn't true. Already in his letters to Debra JIM STYERS confessed to her that the little boy had never made it to the mall.
Det. Mills: Okay, and they asked you to come down to the police station here so they could get maybe a little more detailed statement from you.
Roger Scott: First they asked me questions, then they came back and asked me to come downtown.
Det. Mills: Okay, and you basically volunteered to come downtown?
Roger Scott: Yes sir.
Det. Mills: Okay, so when you came down it was voluntary?
Roger Scott: Yes sir.
Det. Mills: Okay, uh, once you were downtown sometime what early in the morning, early this morning?
Roger Scott: It was uh, 2:00, 2:30.
Det. Mills: Okay, early this morning, okay. Uh, then other officers talked to you and you were aware that JAMES STYERS was down here, right, or Jim was down here.
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Okay, once you were down here detectives talked to you and, on and off throughout the evening or the early morning hours of this early morning and then I contacted you about what, 11:15 or so, thereabouts?
Roger Scott: Uh, yeah.
Det. Mills: Okay. At that time we spoke for about an hour about a variety of subjects, as I recall we talked about places you've worked and Alhambra High School and friends, Jim Wafflard.
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: And you gave me the information about PHIL at that time.
Roger Scott: Correct.
Det. Mills: Okay. And after we talked about that there was still no resolution as to where Christopher was or what had happened to Christopher up until that point, right?
Roger Scott: Correct.
Det. Mills: Okay. You had not told me or anyone else the information that you later told to Armando after he gave you your rights, is that correct?
Roger Scott: Correct.
Det. Mills: Okay. And nobody's you know, used any physical force or ...
Roger Scott: No.
Det. Mills: ... coerced you or, you know...
Roger Scott: No.
Det. Mills: ... beat you, in fact, we've, I and others, have gotten you sodas to drink and...
Roger Scott: Correct.
Det. Mills: ... going to the bathroom and in fact you and I just had a hamburger, correct, because neither one of us had eaten all day.
Roger Scott: Okay, yeah, been pretty nice to me.
Det. Mills: Okay. So basically the reason we are making this, Jim, is so that you're protected and we're protected and everybody is happy that way, okay. Uh, what Armando talked to you after you had been read the rights, what did you tell him, if you would just go ahead and lay out what you told him about what happened to Christopher and the planning of what happened.
Comment: If we look at DET. R. MILLS' technique of questioning SCOTT it becomes clear that he quickly led the suspect on to this core point of the story, and all that ROGER had to do was to simply confirm MILLS' statements with simple 'correct' or 'yeah' replies. Indeed, before SCOTT ever elaborated on the previous happenings MILLS' already suggested that there was a 'planning of what happened'. In other words, before SCOTT could ever explain a single detail he was already set to confirm a story which was later prosecuted as a 'conspiracy', apparently already agreed on between MILLS' and SCOTT. But why would SCOTT agree to tell such a scenario? Could it be he was promised to get off with a lesser charge if he incriminated the two other individuals mentioned, JIM STYERS and Debra Milke? Could it be he was constrained by DET. SALDATE to make these incriminations in order to get away with a tolerable prison sentence [claiming he was solely 'the driver']?
Roger Scott: Jim and I had talked about it a few times and finally the day came and I didn't think that Jim would go through with it but he did, I was driving the car, I heard the gun go off three times, I picked him up, went back to Metro Center and that's when he contacted the security saying that Christopher was lost. And I try and go along with his story and try lying my way out with an imaginary friend named PHIL which took me down to Metro Center and I had not come with Jim. Later on past the morning hours towards noon I believe was when I finally admitted that there was no imaginary PHIL and said that I had gone to Metro Center with Jim and after further conversation I admitted that I did know about the fact, and proceeded to try to help the detectives to the best of my ability by telling the location of the child, the incident, the way it occurred, to the best of my knowledge, the route back to Metro Center, the whole made-up story, uh, where the tennis shoes were thrown out, not _________ has anything to do with it but, uh, and admitting where the gun had been hidden.
Det. Mills: Okay. Let's go through this in a little more detail. Uh, you told Armando and I when we were together driving you out to 99 Avenue that the planning to do away with Christopher...
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: ... started several weeks ago.
Roger Scott: Yes, that's when...
Det. Mills: Who first approached you about doing away with Christopher?
Roger Scott: Uh, Jim did.
Det. Mills: Do you remember what he said?
Roger Scott: He said that, uh, can't remember the exact words, but more or less the kid has to go, I just can't stand him any more, uh, and it went on, I never thought this would finally happen but it did, uh Debra...
Comment: SCOTT started out by saying CHRIS' murder was STYERS' idea. He became confused when trying to implicate Debra, and MILLS tried to help him get that part of the story straight. Another strong indication that the true story of what happened to CHRISTOPHER MILKE was more or less the story of the police, not the real one of SCOTT. But all of MILLS' efforts didn't get SCOTT to tell a consistent story about Debra's so-called involvement. And it's completely contradictory to the true situation of Debra and JIM STYERS at that time, because she had already secured herself an apartment and intended to move out by January 1st, 1990 - therefore STYERS would've had no reason to say "I can't stand him anymore". This shows that SCOTT was obviously given some key sentences he was supposed to make in order to create a foundation for his accusations.
Det. Mills: Let me interrupt you right here, so Jim coaches you and basically makes it known to you that he wants to get rid of Christopher?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Cause he just can't stand him.
Roger Scott: Right.
Comment: MILLS repeated STYERS' alleged reasons himself in order to emphasize the purported motives and to make the story sound more believable...
Det. Mills: And did he tell you that Debra Milke, Christopher's mother, also wanted to get rid of him because she couldn't handle him either?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Comment: Answering yes or no to a leading question is about as much detail as SCOTT could give about Debra's alleged role.
Det. Mills: Okay, that was during the first meeting, or the first conversation about this?
Roger Scott: No, this became later on, well, the fact about Christopher, yes.
Det. Mills: Okay.
Roger Scott: And then I did hear from Debra that _________________ wanted him on for herself.
Det. Mills: Okay, when you had this first conversation with Jim, do you remember where that took place?
Roger Scott: Um, I'm not completely positive, I do believe it was at his apartment.
Comment: ...which explains, as in other parts of this website, that both me, JIM STYERS and ROGER SCOTT have indeed been alone at JIM'S apartment while Debra was at her job. That makes it easy to see how the two men had every possibility to make themselves privy with Debra's personal belongings, including her so-called flex benefits and insurance paperwork. That included, among other services, the dubious life insurance. But it was a part of the social benefits and not a separate police.
Det. Mills: Okay, cause you and he have been friends for some 23, 24 years, thereabouts?
Roger Scott: Around 23 years.
Det. Mills: Okay, so you know each other pretty well you see each other regularly?
Roger Scott: Yeah.
Det. Mills: Okay, so he approaches you about Christopher and he talks to you more than once about Christopher, about doing away with Christopher before you talked face to face with Debbie, is that right?
Comment: Again, MILLS embarked on a futile effort to get a coherent story from SCOTT about the purported involvement of Debra.
Det. Mills: You were not along, you were not along on that trip, you're not there, or were you?
Roger Scott: I was there on Paradise and 7 Street.
Comment: Next, SCOTT, STYERS, and Debra were there.
Det. Mills: You were there?
Roger Scott: Yeah.
Det. Mills: So the three of you went out there?
Roger Scott: No, just Jim and I.
Comment: Suddenly, only STYERS and SCOTT were there.
Det. Mills: Oh, okay, I thought you said that Debbie was out there.
Roger Scott: No, Debbie had gone with Jim so Jim told me, uh.
Det. Mills: On an earlier occasion?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Comment: So here, on "an earlier occasion" JIM and Debra were there.
Det. Mills: Okay, do you know where they went then?
Roger Scott: That was the 7 Street and Beardsley.
Det. Mills: Okay, so they went so...
Roger Scott: And just decided that wasn't good.
Det. Mills: Okay, who decided that, Jim or you?
Comment: MILLS was totally confused at this point.
Roger Scott: Uh, I did.
Comment: And, SCOTT, trying to follow the story that MILLS fed him, added himself to the scene - so again, SCOTT, STYERS, and Debra were there in SCOTT'S story. In his confused attempt to say what he was supposed to say ROGER mixed all the details up.
Det. Mills: Okay, and is that what we're talking about as being last Friday night?
Roger Scott: No, that was, this had been going on for a week trying to...
Det. Mills: Okay, do you know if it was during last week or was it last weekend or when that was?
Roger Scott: Last week to my recollection.
Det. Mills: Okay, do you know what day?
Roger Scott: Like I had said before it had been going on for a week, I don't know exactly the times and dates.
Det. Mills: You can't, let me just tell you, you can't tap the table, okay? 'Cause it drives the typists crazy when they have to type it, okay, cause all they hear is the tapping, you can hit yourself or you know tap your arm on yourself, okay.
Roger Scott: Okay.
Det. Mills: Anyway last week you and Jim went out to 7 Street and Beardsley, 7 Street and Paradise, and you decided that wasn't a good location, I think you had mentioned earlier that there was some talk about the National Guard being out there or something like that?
Comment: DET. MILLS consistently seemed to know the setup much better than ROGER...
Roger Scott: Yes, he said he had taken Christopher out to 7 Street and Paradise and he was thinking of doing it then but then he heard a voice off ahead of him in the dark.
Det. Mills: Uh uh.
Roger Scott: And it turned out to be a National Guard out there, I don't know if they were on maneuvers or what but anyway he forgot about it then.
Det. Mills: Okay. So then last week you and Christopher and Jim went out there again and you decided that wasn't a good location still, right? Yes.
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Okay, but, tell me about last Friday, you said something happened last Friday, the day before the...
Comment: MILLS would have obviously loved to have a coherent account from SCOTT of any prior attempt on CHRIS' life, especially one involving Debra. He made one last effort, and finally gave up.
Roger Scott: There was a spot on the, I can't remember exactly what road, but it was north, pulled off into a neighborhood, thinking of doing it there and uh, there just got to be too much traffic all of a sudden and so had to stop that idea. He had more or less worried each other for a week up until Saturday out of doing it and Saturday I didn't believe he would do it because I didn't hear the shots for a while. I drove up and down the road, I looked for them, um, I saw the, well I looked and could not see them, I beeped the horn a couple of times or once and then again
Det. Mills: Okay.
Roger Scott: But, I could _______
Det. Mills: We'll get into that as _______
Roger Scott: Then I heard the three shots.
Det. Mills: Okay, we'll get into that as time passes, okay. Uh, let me ask you this, what was Christopher told about these trips to the desert?
Roger Scott: Later on he was going to go see Santa Claus, uh we...
Det. Mills: How about Friday's trip to the desert, what was he told then?
Roger Scott: Well that one was about Santa Claus.
Comment: This particular answer is rhetorically crucial and should come to everyone's attention. Upon MILLS' question - obviously not taking SCOTT'S confusion into account - ROGER replied "That one was about Santa Claus." We can see here that SCOTT had a number of terms and phrases in his mind, and when the question appeared right SCOTT was eager to blow these phrases out, no matter whether they were truly fitting replies or not. This is probably the strongest indication that SCOTT didn't voluntarily relate what happened, but that he was convinced to tell a story as previously fed to him by the detectives. And it makes sense, putting ourselves into their shows: Officers who offer such a scenario don't have to stick to their secretly made promises, because it's in the hands of a prosecutor to decide whether to charge someone with a crime, or not. SCOTT on the other hand knew that following the suggested scenario was the only way out for him.
Det. Mills: Santa Claus?
Roger Scott: Yeah.
Comment: Interesting. Here SCOTT alleged that CHRISTOPHER was told that he would see SANTA CLAUS in the desert. Here we can see that SCOTT'S ramblings were later on either completely misused by SALDATE, or they were invented by police and intimidated on SCOTT for the purpose of this tape-recorded interview. This would explain SALDATE'S rush after learning that STYERS refused to make any statement without the presence of an attorney, and it also reveals the true reason why he used a helicopter to go to Florence, where three detectives had already arrived in the meantime and were initially ordered to interview Debra Milke.
Listen to another excerpt from the
original taped interrogation of ROGER SCOTT
Det. Mills: Okay, so comes now actually Saturday morning, yesterday morning, how did you get in contact with Jim?
Roger Scott: Saturday morning?
Det. Mills: Yeah, the day everybody went to Metro Center, yesterday.
Roger Scott: I had called him, uh approximately 10:30, and asked him what he was doing and he says well I gotta go out and do some running around and I'm not sure whether I asked him if he was coming by or he said he might stop by later.
Det. Mills: Uh huh.
Roger Scott: Okay.
Det. Mills: Did you talk about taking care of Christopher?
Roger Scott: Yes, it had to be done.
Comment: Here we see how unbelievable SCOTT'S story truly was. SCOTT replied to the question how he got in contact with JIM that he - SCOTT - had called him up. MILLS became alerted and countered with a leading question: "Did you talk about taking care of Christopher?" In light of SCOTT'S previous sentence the statement "Yes, it had to be done" doesn't make any sense anymore. SCOTT'S true story would have been that the two me had only talked about the intended shopping, and - as all indications show - this is what was solely conversed about.
Det. Mills: You were aware it was going to be done?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Okay, and it was going to be done Saturday?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Okay, so how did you get in physical contact with Jim, how did you come to see him actually?
Roger Scott: He had come over to my house about 11:00 in the morning.
Det. Mills: And he picked you up with Christopher in the car?
Roger Scott: Yeah.
Det. Mills: And whose car were they in?
Roger Scott: Debbie's car.
Det. Mills: What kind of car is that?
Roger Scott: White Toyota, 4-door, Corolla.
Det. Mills: Okay. And uh, you got in the car and where did you go?
Roger Scott: We proceeded out to 99 Avenue.
Det. Mills: Was that first, before you went anywhere else?
Roger Scott: That's uh no, we went to Osco drug store, I needed to _______
Det. Mills: Which Osco?
Roger Scott: At 35th and Glendale.
Det. Mills: Okay, and you went there for what reason?
Roger Scott: To purchase some Christmas gifts.
Det. Mills: Okay.
Roger Scott: And they were out of them and then I had to get a prescription at Walgreen's and that was at 43rd and Glendale and we decided that we were hungry, pizza was discussed, so we went to Peter Piper Pizza where we had pizza and...
Det. Mills: Okay you ordered, I think you told me earlier you ordered a medium special with no onions,
Roger Scott: Yeah.
Det. Mills: Okay, and there was a, you had Sprite
Roger Scott: I had a medium Sprite and Jim had a medium coke and Christopher had a small coke.
Det. Mills: Small coke, okay. So you ate the pizza and then where did you go from there?
Roger Scott: Then we went out to 99 Avenue.
Det. Mills: Okay, who drove out there?
Roger Scott: Jim did as far as Sun City, about halfway through and he said he was tired of driving so uh, says why don't you drive a while so I drove from then on.
Det. Mills: Okay, and you drove out to Sun City, out to 99th Avenue, to that location you took us there, just north of Happy Valley Road, right?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Okay, and when we were out there a little while ago you pointed, it was about uh, earlier this afternoon before sunset, of course, you pointed us to the location in the wash there right off 99 Avenue.
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: When you drove out there, who decided to stop at that location?
Roger Scott: Jim did.
Det. Mills: He told you to stop there?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Okay, and Jim got out?
Roger Scott: Yes, we all did.
Det. Mills: Okay, what did he tell Christopher about getting out?
Roger Scott: Let's go look around for snakes and he had some binoculars and uh, let Chris carry the binoculars and look through them to keep his interest, we were first on the east side of 99th in that wash...
Det. Mills: Uh huh.
Roger Scott: ...crossed the 99th to the west side there, we walked into the wash, uh, approximately 50 feet, and he says I will do it up there (inaudible)... find the body for a couple of days...
(at this point turned tape over)
Roger Scott: Past Jomax Road again and then turned around coming south and pulled over to the side and I still hadn't heard anything yet and I couldn't see anybody. That's when I got out of the car and started to walk out into the desert where I could be seen and possibly see them and I thought, you know, he decided not to but that's when I heard the three shots.
Det. Mills: Were you in the wash when the three shots rang out?
Roger Scott: No, I was north of the wash.
Det. Mills: Up on the little hill there?
Roger Scott: Yeah, uh, possibly 1000 feet is a guess, or further...
Det. Mills: That's no problem, okay. And then after you heard the shots, you heard how many shots?
Roger Scott: Three.
Det. Mills: Three. How were they spaced? You know, one right after the other or was it ...
Roger Scott: Bang, bang, bang.
Det. Mills: Okay, so they were spaced pretty evenly.
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Okay. So when you heard the shots you walked, it would have been southbound ...
Roger Scott: I drove southbound, Jim was out on the road and...
Det. Mills: Where did he come out on the road, right there at the wash?
Roger Scott: Just north of the wash.
Det. Mills: Just north of the wash, okay. So then you picked him up and he got in the car?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Okay, what did he say?
Roger Scott: Exact words I can't say but more or less, well that's done and uh, let's get out of here.
Det. Mills: Okay, and he had the gun with him, right?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: And you were still driving...
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: And you drove south on 99 Avenue.
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: And then eastbound on Union Hills.
Roger Scott: Turned left on Union Hills.
Det. Mills: Okay.
Roger Scott: Proceeded to Black Canyon Highway.
Det. Mills: Okay, let me stop you. In between 99 Avenue and 83 Avenue where the construction starts, what happened in that space?
Roger Scott: Oh yes, that was where Jim had emptied the shells out of the gun and he was, had tossed them out to the right side of the road which would be south of Union Hills where it's curved or past the curve.
Det. Mills: Yeah.
Roger Scott: Uh, one at a time spacing them out, uh, it was approximately a, oh, a few blocks, I'm not exactly sure but anyway it was, it was a ways past uh, 99th.
Det. Mills: Okay. So that happened.
Roger Scott: It was closer to the construction area.
Det. Mills: That would be _______
Roger Scott: Intersection of...
Det. Mills: Right, a 4 way stop out there.
Roger Scott: Yeah.
Det. Mills: What did he tell you about the gun when you were en route to Metro Center? What did he want you to do with the gun?
Roger Scott: He wanted me to, uh, take it...
Det. Mills: And do what with it?
Roger Scott: And to get rid of it after the security and all had been called.
Comment: What the heck does mall security have to do in combination with getting rid of the gun? It doesn't make any sense! In fact, it doesn't make any sense to claim that STYERS purportedly gave the gun to SCOTT. Why would he? Why would he intentionally get into the danger of getting caught by giving a murder weapon to somebody else? Nothing makes sense here...
Det. Mills: Okay, let me stop, let me stop you right here. So you drive -
Roger Scott: (inaudible)
Det. Mills: Don't apologize, there's no problem. You know, we've been together a lot of hours and nobody's yelled at you and you haven't yelled at me and we've been getting along pretty good so...
Comment: Again, interesting. Why would SCOTT apologize himself toward MILLS? Could it be he confused another detail of what he was supposed to say? It can't get any clearer that SCOTT solely attempted to repeat a scenario suggested to him by somebody else, told to him by police detectives!
Roger Scott: Yeah.
Det. Mills: Been no problems. So you get to Metro Center. Did you still have the gun on you or was ...
Roger Scott: No, the gun was in the glove compartment.
Det. Mills: Okay.
Roger Scott: And we went into Metro Center, we separated like we were not together.
Det. Mills: Don't worry about tapping the table. (laughter) That's all right.
Roger Scott: Anyway, uh, we had separated like we were not together and that was
Det. Mills: That was the plan
Roger Scott: More or less the agreement and then as time went on towards about 3:20 in the afternoon he approached me with a girl that works at Sears, a HOLLY, I believe her name was.
Comment: This little incident is completely in sync with out assumption that the sole reason for STYERS and SCOTT to meet at the Metro Center was that SCOTT would show up there and claim to be a witness for the presence of CHRISTOPHER.
Det. Mills: Okay.
Roger Scott: And, uh, he said that she had been helping him look around the store, asked me if I'd seen him, and uh, I said no and that's where I said that PHIL had picked me up back at the house a couple hours earlier so uh, possibly 3, and...
Det. Mills: So that would be so you would distance yourself away from Metro Center, of being there the same time Jim was there.
Roger Scott: Right.
Det. Mills: Okay, and that was the PHIL who really doesn't exist.
Roger Scott: True.
Det. Mills: Okay. So security talks to you at Metro Center and police talk to you Metro Center.
Roger Scott: Uh, the police didn't talk to me at Metro Center until that evening we went down to re-enact the, where the supposed PHIL was parked and where Jim was parked, where I had separated company with Jim to go to the bus stop which then was in my possession of the gun.
Det. Mills: Okay, let's back up for just a moment. We talked just a little bit earlier about the shoes. When were the shoes put in the location that you took us to then just north of Sears?
Roger Scott: When he gave me the gun to take with me and he says well here why don't you put these in the dumpster and I, I know he thought about throwing those shoes out after the job that he wanted to do with Chris was done and he wanted to use them but I don't know if he used them that day or not, but anyway he wanted them thrown out. I did not see a dumpster so I just dropped them in between the bushes.
Det. Mills: That location
Roger Scott: Cause I didn't want to carry them all over the parking lot.
Det. Mills: And you took us to them there just north of Sears.
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Yeah, okay. Well that was, you got the gun and the shoes and you took care of the shoes and then you got on the bus and went home. Remember about what time that was you got on the bus?
Roger Scott: The bus was to leave at 4:21 but did not depart until 4:22. I uh,...
Det. Mills: Why do you remember those times?
Roger Scott: Because the schedule was at the bus stop.
Det. Mills: Uh, okay
Roger Scott: Sort of a big theater listing.
Det. Mills: Uh, okay.
Roger Scott: It has the numbers of the buses that stop there on one side and that, but where are the times, this isn't much help, just sit here and wait for the bus. And I had walked around being a little nervous and you know...
Det. Mills: A gun in your pocket
Roger Scott: Yeah, and a gun in my belt and trying to keep it hidden, such in my stomach so it wouldn't be noticed and I noticed on the uh, other side of the side with the numbers were the schedules and so I looked up #3 bus which is the one that goes down 43rd back towards my house and uh, got on the bus and left.
Det. Mills: Okay. And then you took the gun with you and where is the gun now?
Roger Scott: It's in my house.
Det. Mills: Okay, what color is the gun?
Roger Scott: It's black with uh, brown plastic handles.
Det. Mills: You know the brand?
Roger Scott: R & G.
Det. Mills: It's and R & G. You know the caliber?
Roger Scott: .22.
Det. Mills: Okay, and where did you put the gun in your house?
Roger Scott: In my closet in the uh, one of my parts boxes, uh, of radio and TV repair equipment that I...
Det. Mills: So you put it down in there.
Roger Scott: ...scraps that I had to fix things with.
Det. Mills: Okay. And then later on the police came talked to you, early this morning they brought you down here, right, or you came down here with them.
Roger Scott: Yeah, I voluntarily came.
Det. Mills: Right.
Roger Scott: Acting like nothing was wrong.
Det. Mills: Have you received any money from Jim or Debbie to this point?
Roger Scott: No.
Det. Mills: Okay.
Roger Scott: There was a point of waiting for the insurance more or less.
Det. Mills: Okay. For the life insurance to go through.
Roger Scott: Yeah.
Det. Mills: Nobody has made any promises to you have they?
Roger Scott: No.
Det. Mills: Nobody has threatened you?
Roger Scott: No.
Det. Mills: Uh, what I need to do now is uh, there's a form called a consent to search form.
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Okay, and basically it's a consent to search your house for that gun. And you already told us where it is.
Roger Scott: Yeah.
Det. Mills: Do you have any spare ammunition for that gun?
Roger Scott: It's uh, in the gun itself.
Det. Mills: Okay. When you've been at Jim's, do you know if he had spare ammunition for that gun?
Roger Scott: I am not sure if he does or not, he has three .22's counting that one.
Det. Mills: Right.
Roger Scott: So.
Det. Mills: Do you know if he got a receipt for that gun?
Roger Scott: I somewhat doubt it, uh, it was, the guns were purchased at gun shows that they have listed in the paper usually out in Mesa, and uh, around, I forget what they call the place but it's sort of like their own Civic Center.
Det. Mills: Okay.
Roger Scott: In their town where they have big gun shows and they sell guns across the counter like you would go into a Circle K and buy a roll of Certs. You just put the money down and take it with you.
Det. Mills: Were you there when he purchased that gun?
Roger Scott: The first gun, yes.
Det. Mills: The gun that you have at your house?
Roger Scott: No.
Det. Mills: Oh, you weren't there when he purchased that gun.
Roger Scott: No that was 3 to 4 days later when he bought the other two guns. He had gone himself.
Det. Mills: Okay.
Roger Scott: _______________ went to that same one they have several different ones in different locations. They're usually around the Tempe and Mesa area.
Det. Mills: Okay. Uh, try to think of anything else to talk to you about that we need to get down on tape. Uh, basically I'm going to ask you to sign that consent to search form.
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: You know, for the gun, uh, we want to look for any bullets, too.
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Gun bullets, that kind of thing. As I told you before we had a DET. KAVANAGH out at your home. I realize your mother's ill.
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Okay. And she has been told of what the situation is, exactly what she was told I don't know but she's aware of what the situation is. Is there anything you just want to say?
Roger Scott: I believe that covers the whole thing.
Det. Mills: Okay. Is there anything we've forgotten?
Roger Scott: I don't believe so.
Det. Mills: Okay. And you've made what you told me here in the last uh, 45 minutes or so, you've told me that voluntarily?
Roger Scott: Yes sir.
Det. Mills: Okay, and without any threats or promises or...
Roger Scott: No threats, no promises.
Det. Mills: Okay, oh I will tell you this. Uh, I am going to need to get your boots.
Roger Scott: Okay.
Det. Mills: Okay, I'll tell you that now, we'll get those here after a little bit. Oh, you are on medication and you're taking an inhaler for asthma...
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: And Dilantin, right.
Roger Scott: Dilantin for seizures.
Det. Mills: Seizures, but it's been approximately 4 months, give or take a little bit, since you had the last seizure?
Roger Scott: Yes, but I had that seizure because of the fact that the doctor was trying to knock me down from 3 doses a day to 2 and uh, it wasn't working and I felt one coming on and I just went back up to 3. My doctor is hard to get hold of so I just did my own.
Det. Mills: How did you feel right now, as far as physically?
Roger Scott: I feel better now that I've told the story and it is, I do know the consequences but still I do feel better, it's easier on me.
Det. Mills: Okay. But that's how you feel emotionally but physically you're, you feel okay, you've had something to eat, you've taken your medication this afternoon, right?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Okay, that's what I'm trying to get at. And other than your prescription medicine you're not under the influence of any alcohol?
Roger Scott: No.
Det. Mills: No other drugs other than your prescription medication?
Roger Scott: No. Prescription.
Det. Mills: I'm going to shut the tape off now and I'm going to get one of those consent to search forms
Roger Scott: Okay.
Det. Mills: And I'll ask you to sign it and we'll go from there.
Roger Scott: Okay.
Det. Mills: Okay. And I now have the time by my watch as 9:03, again it is the 3rd of December, 1989.
Det. Mills: We're back on the tape now, it's still December 3, 1989 and the time by my watch is 9:O3 PM and I have the consent to search form and I'm here again with ROGER SCOTT, 620 West Washington. ROGER would you read that form aloud if you would and...
Roger Scott: (inaudible)
Det. Mills: Yeah please.
Roger Scott: Dated December 3, 1989, I ROGER SCOTT, give my consent to authorized police officers of the City of Phoenix, Arizona to conduct a complete search of the property located at 4816 West Bethany Home Road, Apt. 4120, said search to be conducted on December 3, 1989. These officers will be authorized to, by me to take from the above described property any items necessary to their investigation. I understand that the items could be used in evidence against me in a criminal prosecution. This written permission is being given by me without threats or promises of any kind.
Det. Mills: Do you agree with what you just read there?
Roger Scott: Yeah.
Det. Mills: Okay, would you go ahead and sign that then?
Det. Mills: And I've gone ahead and signed it there as a witness, is that correct?
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Okay. How far did you go through school?
Roger Scott: Graduated 8th grade, went 2 1/2 years to Carl Hayden, went a year to Alhambra, then dropped out completely, at the age of 21 received a G.E.D. which is acknowledged as nothing more than an 8th grade education.
Det. Mills: Well, no, it's graduation.
Roger Scott: No the...
Det. Mills: Diploma
Roger Scott: ... by SSI.
Det. Mills: Oh, by SSI.
Roger Scott: Yeah, that's how they evaluated it, well 8th grade. G.E.D.'s don't count to them.
Det. Mills: Okay, as of today you're not on any disability program, is that correct?
Roger Scott: No (inaudible)
Det. Mills: But you had applied at one time to be on SSI.
Roger Scott: Yes.
Det. Mills: Is that because of your seizures?
Roger Scott: Yes, that, bad back, arthritis, uh, it's...
Det. Mills: But not for -
Roger Scott: I forget what all's is listed on the lawyer's paper now, it's into a lawyer's hands, which he is trying to uh...
Det. Mills: __________________
Roger Scott: When they deny it they try to start it up again by you know, can't think of the name of that...
Det. Mills: Appeal.
Roger Scott: Appeal, yeah.
Det. Mills: Okay, but it's not for any mental or emotional problems, what your disability would be based on?
Roger Scott: No.
Det. Mills: Okay. Do you have any questions you want to ask me?
Roger Scott: No, looks like it's been covered.
Det. Mills: Okay. I'll go ahead and shut the tape off again now. It's now 9:17 by my watch. It's still December 3, 1989.
